Back in The Day...

[Windedv6]

Comments were made on another thread about the good old days of car audio...PG Cyclone Sub, PPi amps, competing and staying up all weekend and all that sh%#.

Here is a few pics of my Ty when I was competing...

My 93 Ty and my 94 Somona...

TY #0883

TY #0883

PG Cyclone sub setup...

8" mid base door speakers...

Billet grills for 8" door speakers...

HLCD in the dash...

Dynaudio Center Channel...

12 disc changer in the center console...

The stereo setup diagram...

And the only reason we really did it....

It almost makes me think of giving up the go fast stuff and do this again. I have to admit it was a blast.

John

 

[JSM]

Re: Back in The Day...

I remember back in last year of HS my buddy and I preping his truck for a local ISCA comp. Not that we thought we would win, just for experience.

Back then SPL was part of the score, and our system wasn't designed for SPL's above hearing damage levels. We did do fairly well in sound stage quality, considering. (90 mazda pickup standard cab)

I remember we got knocked down for the sub box not being bolted down, even though it was jammed between seat and back of cab and didn't move. Condsidering my buddy was 300lb or so, it really didn't move when he was in it.

It was fun and worth the effort.

Saw a syclone that day also, but at time didn't pay real attention to it, aside from wow there is a syclone.

I am sure I saw John's truck in mags back then.

 

[epix]

Re: Back in The Day...

Cool stuff for sure.. I remember you showing my buddies and I your 94 Sonoma shortly after I bought my Typhoon. Still have the image of the bed full of audio equipment in my mind.

Back then I knew practically nothing about car audio, thats definently changed over the past few years. Still, nonetheless I knew your setups in both the Ty and Sonoma were impressive..

I don't really have any "old school" audio, kinda stepped right into the realm of audio with mp3s.. I know how everything today is geared for SPL rather than SQ.. I've tried to get a both of each into my current setup:

Front: Pioneer 4x6 plates
Components: CDT 5.25" midwoofers and tweeters in Q-Logic kickpanel (reinforced w/ dynamat)
Rears: Infinity Kappa 6x9's (I really want to make a mount to fit in some round 6" speakers instead)
Subs: 2x Adire Tempest in custom ported 8.0cu enclosure
Amps: Boss 3000D (shitty..) for subs, Lightning Audio Strike amp (Rockford Fosgate internals) for rears/components

I plan on changing the sub amp to sometihng a bit more 'quality' such as a HiFonics or JBL
I've always wanted to try my hand in fiberglass, that may be something I can learn this summer.

 

[JAY]

Re: Back in The Day...

What kind of SPL did you get out of that Servo? You cant find those anywhere anymore.

 

[QUICK STORM]

Re: Back in The Day...

cool pics

 

[ZavzTy547]

Re: Back in The Day...

cool pics

I remember the Cyclone sub, It was pretty innovative subwoofer-sounded like two 18's...
I remember those days. I used to work for a car audio retailer called Car Toys back in the early 90's.
I had a jeep wrangler that I used to compete locally. I had 1 soundstream pro 18" sub, 2 pairs of MB quarts, audio control center stage eq, an epicenter and a fosgate 1000 ampI Now I'm partually death.

 

[Robert Lone]

Re: Back in The Day...

Here's a ghost from the past for you guys...

Richard Clark

Remember him and his 6 speaker stereo? 2-15's, 2-10's and 2 horns. That's it as far as I remember.
Didn't he use to work for NASA? Didn't he get banned from competition in one or more sanctions for winning too much?

 

[Timbo]

Re: Back in The Day...

Here's a ghost from the past for you guys...

Richard Clark

Remember him and his 6 speaker stereo? 2-15's, 2-10's and 2 horns. That's it as far as I remember.
Didn't he use to work for NASA? Didn't he get banned from competition in one or more sanctions for winning too much?

AKty92 was just telling me about him and his car the other day. Really cool.

 

[Windedv6]

Re: Back in The Day...

What kind of SPL did you get out of that Servo? You cant find those anywhere anymore.

I could get upper 140dbb but never cracked a 150 or better. If it was in a smaller vehicle then the Ty it could get there.

Here's a ghost from the past for you guys...

Richard Clark

Remember him and his 6 speaker stereo? 2-15's, 2-10's and 2 horns. That's it as far as I remember.
Didn't he use to work for NASA? Didn't he get banned from competition in one or more sanctions for winning too much?

I knew Richard, he was over the top. One year he brought a 50" or bigger woofer in some kind of old milk truck. It was going to be the SPL killer of the day. Something broke and he never got it to burp. I actually went to using horns for my trucks because Richard was judging the expert classes for a while. He was always partial to horns, which gave us some advantage. I also had a Canton tweeter and 4" midrange kick setup in the Ty along with the horns. I could switchbetween the two and different eq program setup for each.

I could cover my horns and you never know that they were there. Reason was back then then you had the audiophiles that were into staging and listening depth (Richard's groupies) and the old school analog purists. In the pro and expert you knew all the judges and which camp they were in. We could switch our system to the judges taste. It was all about points...you did what you had to do to get those judges on your side.

John

 

[dgoodhue]

Re: Back in The Day...

That is a lot of equipment stuff'd into a Typhoon.

I noticed the A/B switch, I knew you used horns to compete. You explaination makes sense, I intially was thinking you had street/competiton setup.

I really don't know that much about the Pioneers ODR line, other than it was way hell out of my price range. Are all those 5 ODR amps? Are they Digital Input Amps?

 

[warmpancakes]

Re: Back in The Day...

John do you still have that dash

 

[Joey Allen]

Re: Back in The Day...

As Edith would say "those were the good ole days". Didn't have a Ty or Sy but I was a S10 guy. My two creations consisted of a S10 with 6, 15" punches in the bed with 5, punch 45's. Then guy pulled out in front of me and truck was totaled. So then I got a Blazer with 4, 15's and still had the back seat with 6, punch 45's. Both hitting 135+ db's, the coolest thing was making my windshield wipers jump off the windshield an 1inch or so in the Blaze. At one point and time had plans of putting 4 more 15's in the blaze and still keep the rear seat, but it never happened. One last flashback moment Billy Thorpe and Children of the Sun......man that hit hard.

 

[Windedv6]

Re: Back in The Day...

That is a lot of equipment stuff'd into a Typhoon.

I noticed the A/B switch, I knew you used horns to compete. You explaination makes sense, I intially was thinking you had street/competiton setup.

I really don't know that much about the Pioneers ODR line, other than it was way hell out of my price range. Are all those 5 ODR amps? Are they Digital Input Amps?

I also had a switch and different EQ settings for the different subs. The cyclone had a better sub base response for SQ, but only could use about 250 watts. I also broke the veins (paddles) a couple of times pushing it to hard. I could bridge down the PQ 0.5 amp to give the four X-Max subs 1,000 watts and do a little better with the spl scores without hurting them. I never blew one of the X-Max subs. And interesting note is that the Cyclone could perform almost the same spl as the four tens on 25% of the power. The switching setups on both the front setup and the sub setup also allow us to demo the different sound and abilities between the horns and kicks as well as between the two different types of subs. (How else do you think I got PG to sponser me!!!) You could compare the sub difference at the flip of a switch.... in the same envirorment. Also the horns are so efficent that I was only using 15 watts per channel vs 50watts per channel on the each pair of midrange speakers. The horns blew away the kicks from and a db comparison, but the horns were harder to control fron an EQ standpoint though.

The two RS-A1 amps are 15x2 watt pure class A digital. They have no internal switching and are running the rails hot all the time. One ran the HLCD at 15 watts each and could be A/B switched to the front tweeters. The other ran dual voice coil custom ID 8" mid base speakers at 30watts (bridged). We had no problem running the gains wide open if needed as these amps have like .0005 distortion. They were probably the cleanest amps you could run on horns or tweeters/midrange speakers back then. Probably why a lot of ODR systems were winning then.

The ODR RS-A50 is a digital input, Class C, 50x4 watt amp. Two channels to the 4" midrange speakers in the kicks and two channels to the 5.25" separates in the rear for a little rear fill.

The RS-P1 is the main digital controller and the RS-P50 is the digital to analog converter for the two PG sub amps. The RS-P50 also has a 30watt mono amp built-in for my dynaudio center channel speaker. Everything except the A/B switch was controlled through the joy stick remote including twin 31 band EQs (right and left Channels) with six custom presets each, gain settings for every amp, band width and multi slopes for every channel, and time alignment for every channel. In theroy I had two different systems in the truck, but could run several combinations.

John do you still have that dash

I do. It is currently in the Ty. I am thinking about reinstalling some of my system back in the Ty this summer when my other Ty gets finished. I plan on using the a short version of the ODR system and the analog PQ 0.5 amps in the tail gate with the RS-P50 amp for the kicks. The sub is going to be a modified clone-looking NOS tank with a custom sub speaker good for 200 - 300 watts. (Got to stay with the race look!) My plans are to detune the Ty for a mid to upper 11 second street/show truck.

John

 

[Timbo]

Re: Back in The Day...

detune

That's a dirty word.

 

[Spinall4]

Re: Back in The Day...

I saw the system diagram, and first thing I though was " Horns and tweeters, this guy must like his highs or is F'n crazy" then saw the part about the a/b switching thing.

Did the center channel bring up the sound stage, and image? I'm starting to together Ideas for my set up in the ty, and all I really want is the imposible. Good sound stage & image, lots of midbass, and insane low F3. All I need are a couple IDW 18's, ID to make some IDQv2 8's, and an insane 3 way componet set up with silk dome tweeters.

 

[Windedv6]

Re: Back in The Day...

I saw the system diagram, and first thing I though was " Horns and tweeters, this guy must like his highs or is F'n crazy" then saw the part about the a/b switching thing.

Did the center channel bring up the sound stage, and image? I'm starting to together Ideas for my set up in the ty, and all I really want is the imposible. Good sound stage & image, lots of midbass, and insane low F3. All I need are a couple IDW 18's, ID to make some IDQv2 8's, and an insane 3 way componet set up with silk dome tweeters.

The center channel really leveled out the dash height for staging and imaging. Good enough for a number of seconds and thirds in the IASCA and USCA finals...pro and expert classes.

To explain how tough the expert class was...One year I missed winning the USAC World Finals in the expert class by five points because I had PG (Phoenix Gold) rebuild my 160 amp alternator to a 200 amp and I switched my power wire from 2 guage to O gauge. The new plate on the alternator only showed a PG part number and no amp output number. They tagged me because I updated my book explaining the 200amp upgrade and the O gauge wire, but couldn't prove it was really a 200 amp alternator.

Since I had a 200 amp main breaker and no proof of the alternator output, I was deemed to have to big of a breaker for the system. They deducted 10 points for that otherwise I would have won by 5 points. the PG head guys were there protesting and the judge gave us the allowed ten minutes to prove it, but no one there including the PG booth had a parts book the would have shown the part number and the corresponding 200amp output. The ten minutes pasted and I got the dedcution. MTX was the big sponsor of USAC and even though PG protested about getting a max deduction for such an oversite, the MTX factory car build by Jason Blank took the win by five points. Now that's politics!!!

You have to be careful with a center channel has it will start to effect your width of the stage. To much will start bringing the sides in. It's not bad with the horns because the stage is so wide with them to start with. I also redid my seat brackets which allowed me to move my seat back about six inches for competing. Helped a lot with the path lengths which helped imaging.

John

 

[Spinall4]

Re: Back in The Day...

Just like everything else in life, full of peoples bs. Did they claim you were cheating by using the 200 amp breaker, just beacuse of that little less resistance you get from going to the higher amperage (know thats how it is with fuses, never tested it with breakers)? Its all about protecing the wire, not the amps. and 0 awg will certinly carry 200 amps. Hell, I've seen oem 6 awg with a 125-150 amp main fuses. On top of that, I've always been told to go a little higher than you need with the breaker, beacuse when you get close to the actual rating, they start to trip alot, and once they've heated up and tripped once they do it over & over again.

Ever toyed around with any of the time alingment stuff? Alpines 9855 for last year had it for all 4 speakers. Not to shabby for a 450$ retail deck. I would really like a 3 way with the tweeter & 4" up top, with the mid range in a kick, then some mid bass in the doors.

 

[Jimmy]

Re: Back in The Day...

IMO it was cool back in the day because it was new and fresh technology.But now it's played out.Everyone and anyone can be loud.

Apparently the need for bass can also make you retarded,as evidenced by Scot Van Weiner's total destruction of a MINT 30k mile red/red 93 Ty that he made into a boom box.

 

[Windedv6]

Re: Back in The Day...

Just like everything else in life, full of peoples bs. Did they claim you were cheating by using the 200 amp breaker, just beacuse of that little less resistance you get from going to the higher amperage (know thats how it is with fuses, never tested it with breakers)? Its all about protecing the wire, not the amps. and 0 awg will certinly carry 200 amps. Hell, I've seen oem 6 awg with a 125-150 amp main fuses. On top of that, I've always been told to go a little higher than you need with the breaker, beacuse when you get close to the actual rating, they start to trip alot, and once they've heated up and tripped once they do it over & over again.

Ever toyed around with any of the time alingment stuff? Alpines 9855 for last year had it for all 4 speakers. Not to shabby for a 450$ retail deck. I would really like a 3 way with the tweeter & 4" up top, with the mid range in a kick, then some mid bass in the doors.

They had a rule book item that didn't allow the breaker to be larger than the source. Although I had an 200amp alternator, I had no proof of it. It was just crazy types of rules that the expert class would get nailed with as we were supposed to set the example for other classes and were judged fairly harshly. The irony of the breaker matching the source is that when an alternator gets hot the out drops 10-20% anyway. In theory you could never get it matched anyway. Stupid rule someone came up with.

I used the time alignment in all my settings. You can go to far with it and get into phase problems. The ODR system had the ability to reverse the phase on each speaker which was nice.

John

 

[jwaller]

Re: Back in The Day...

and I give you crap about your truck being heavy now!!! hahahaha.