warmpancakes
New member
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
Just get a disclaimer and you dont need to worry
Just get a disclaimer and you dont need to worry
Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
- Thread starter Syborg Twin Turbo
- Start date
Robert Lone
MUTANT
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
Now I have to think of something whitty to type in my sig.
I hate you Ken.:fist:
Damn good point there Ken...:tup:warmpancakes said:
Now I have to think of something whitty to type in my sig.
I hate you Ken.:fist:
warmpancakes
New member
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
try this
"ive learned you should always carry to sacks where ever you go that way if anybody asks you to help you can say nope ive got these sacks"
try this
"ive learned you should always carry to sacks where ever you go that way if anybody asks you to help you can say nope ive got these sacks"
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
I think a 6 speed conversion would be sweet. I initially thought about building my GT with a T-56, of course i still can im not commited yet.
Anyways you dont need any kind of custom adaoptors ir anything like that, just get a T-56 out of an LT1 camaro, and use the LT1 bellhousing, clutch assembly and fllywheel and starter, you will need to drill one new start mounting hole in the block, as the LT1 has staright across starter bolts not offset like the stock 4.3 starter. You will need a custom trans crossmenber, but thats not a hard item to fab up and of course a shorter driveshaft, and the shifter will come thru the floor about 4 inches back from where it would come thru on a stock S-10 T-5 trans. Ive seen it done on quit a few S-10s and really isnt that hard, almost a complete bolt in.
I think a 6 speed conversion would be sweet. I initially thought about building my GT with a T-56, of course i still can im not commited yet.
Anyways you dont need any kind of custom adaoptors ir anything like that, just get a T-56 out of an LT1 camaro, and use the LT1 bellhousing, clutch assembly and fllywheel and starter, you will need to drill one new start mounting hole in the block, as the LT1 has staright across starter bolts not offset like the stock 4.3 starter. You will need a custom trans crossmenber, but thats not a hard item to fab up and of course a shorter driveshaft, and the shifter will come thru the floor about 4 inches back from where it would come thru on a stock S-10 T-5 trans. Ive seen it done on quit a few S-10s and really isnt that hard, almost a complete bolt in.
Robert Lone
MUTANT
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
My shifter is in the stock location. No it wasn't easy or cheap. Yes the shifter shaft was shortened.
My shifter is in the stock location. No it wasn't easy or cheap. Yes the shifter shaft was shortened.
warmpancakes
New member
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
so you have a short shaft?
so you have a short shaft?
Robert Lone
MUTANT
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
I'm white. Whatta you think...:rotf:warmpancakes said:
HighPerformanceTrucks
Lift & Shift Specialist
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
I assume you are talking about a 2wd build correct?
I assume you are talking about a 2wd build correct?
HotRodV6 said:
'JustDreamin'
Dream: 6LV8 Turbo Bravada
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
A few comments from the peanut gallery.....
The T56 setup in T56's truck is highly modified to put the shifter in the stock location (or really close) although last I checked, the truck originally was an auto, so I'm not real sure how it was determined it was the stock location.
You could certainly run the LT1 bellhousing / clutch / pressureplate / flywheel (which btw is GOOFY looking, its not flat). The drawback would be that the transmission would be moved rearward which obviously would move the shifter and transfer case rearward. That rearward movement might not be a big deal, but it could be (depends upon your application).
IMO, the rear extension housing is the super critical item. You've got to reveal enough of the rear output shaft to mount the t-case up (with adequate spline engagement), which means that the housing has to be shortened, and you've got to provide a mounting surface for the t-case (which means adding material to the extension housing). Obviously these two activities compete against each other (ahh, the joys of building custom parts).
There are a couple of extension housings available for the T56. I'd suggest getting with a big T56 rebuilder (like Rockland Standard or Keisler) and pick their brains as to what has the shifter the furthest forward and any other suggestions they can provide. I've recently dealt with Rockland Standard (for a custom NV 136/246 hybrid tcase) and George (in the tech department) knows his stuff. He might be able to help pick the best ext. housing for this purpose.
Rockland is also making a bunch of super duper alloy parts for the trans to beef it up (they claim the ability to handle 1200hp and 1000 ft-lbs (its called Transzilla). I know that includes a 9310 mainshaft & gears, don't know about the output shaft. You might could have them make a custom longer output shaft to help with modification of the ext. housing.
Ivanko mentioned that welding alum creates problems. It does. IF the aluminum has any heat treatment, welding on it will pretty much kill the heat treat and anneal it. Also, you've got potential issues with warpage. And since the extension housing is a casting, it has some casting porosity, which means a used one will have some quantity of ATF in the casting, making it a whole lot more fun to weld. So either you've got to get the ATF out (bake it a 500 degrees for a couple hours to burn it off) or start with a new part (no oil exposure).
I thought seriously about this when I was planning my Bravada buildup, but ultimately ruled it out. Strength, cost, and the amount of engineering required were above what I was really interested in doing. Add to that the fact that the wife doesn't drive stick (already have 1 car she can't drive, she doesn't want 2) and I need to use this for regular tow duty (only 4000lbs, but towing is something that I don't think any T56 has been used for or rated for) and I decided the 80E was my best choice. I would have liked to have been able to shift for myself, though.
For a number of applications (like autocrossing) I think the manual would be an excellent choice. Probably ought to decide whether you really need 6 gears, though, as for most autocross applications you probably could get by very nicely with a 4 speed. 4 speed would probably be cheaper, easier, and a bunch lighter (since the T56 is a big heavy thing which weighs something like 200 lbs). But there is something cool about having double overdrive......
'JustDreamin'
A few comments from the peanut gallery.....
The T56 setup in T56's truck is highly modified to put the shifter in the stock location (or really close) although last I checked, the truck originally was an auto, so I'm not real sure how it was determined it was the stock location.
You could certainly run the LT1 bellhousing / clutch / pressureplate / flywheel (which btw is GOOFY looking, its not flat). The drawback would be that the transmission would be moved rearward which obviously would move the shifter and transfer case rearward. That rearward movement might not be a big deal, but it could be (depends upon your application).
IMO, the rear extension housing is the super critical item. You've got to reveal enough of the rear output shaft to mount the t-case up (with adequate spline engagement), which means that the housing has to be shortened, and you've got to provide a mounting surface for the t-case (which means adding material to the extension housing). Obviously these two activities compete against each other (ahh, the joys of building custom parts).
There are a couple of extension housings available for the T56. I'd suggest getting with a big T56 rebuilder (like Rockland Standard or Keisler) and pick their brains as to what has the shifter the furthest forward and any other suggestions they can provide. I've recently dealt with Rockland Standard (for a custom NV 136/246 hybrid tcase) and George (in the tech department) knows his stuff. He might be able to help pick the best ext. housing for this purpose.
Rockland is also making a bunch of super duper alloy parts for the trans to beef it up (they claim the ability to handle 1200hp and 1000 ft-lbs (its called Transzilla). I know that includes a 9310 mainshaft & gears, don't know about the output shaft. You might could have them make a custom longer output shaft to help with modification of the ext. housing.
Ivanko mentioned that welding alum creates problems. It does. IF the aluminum has any heat treatment, welding on it will pretty much kill the heat treat and anneal it. Also, you've got potential issues with warpage. And since the extension housing is a casting, it has some casting porosity, which means a used one will have some quantity of ATF in the casting, making it a whole lot more fun to weld. So either you've got to get the ATF out (bake it a 500 degrees for a couple hours to burn it off) or start with a new part (no oil exposure).
I thought seriously about this when I was planning my Bravada buildup, but ultimately ruled it out. Strength, cost, and the amount of engineering required were above what I was really interested in doing. Add to that the fact that the wife doesn't drive stick (already have 1 car she can't drive, she doesn't want 2) and I need to use this for regular tow duty (only 4000lbs, but towing is something that I don't think any T56 has been used for or rated for) and I decided the 80E was my best choice. I would have liked to have been able to shift for myself, though.
For a number of applications (like autocrossing) I think the manual would be an excellent choice. Probably ought to decide whether you really need 6 gears, though, as for most autocross applications you probably could get by very nicely with a 4 speed. 4 speed would probably be cheaper, easier, and a bunch lighter (since the T56 is a big heavy thing which weighs something like 200 lbs). But there is something cool about having double overdrive......
'JustDreamin'
George Blake
DONATING MEMBER
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
Back when yank did transmissions, this was a piece prototyped so guys could run the 4l65 input drum in an old 700r4. It is a 5/8" spacer that goes between the engine and the trans. It has everything machined into it. Dowl locating holes, everything.
If it will help, let me know.
If you want a 4L80E that shifts like a stick, I can set that up as well. It uses no computer but the kit runs $350 to do it and the trans cannot be converter back once it's done.
Back when yank did transmissions, this was a piece prototyped so guys could run the 4l65 input drum in an old 700r4. It is a 5/8" spacer that goes between the engine and the trans. It has everything machined into it. Dowl locating holes, everything.
If it will help, let me know.
If you want a 4L80E that shifts like a stick, I can set that up as well. It uses no computer but the kit runs $350 to do it and the trans cannot be converter back once it's done.
Robert Lone
MUTANT
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
My bellhousing is very short soley for moving the trans forward in the truck. This makes the shifter and T-case location problems less severe.
My bellhousing is very short soley for moving the trans forward in the truck. This makes the shifter and T-case location problems less severe.
George Blake
DONATING MEMBER
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
If you guys are really serious, check this out. It doesn't address the transfer case end, but the engine end is taken care of...
http://www.weirhotrodproducts.com/
If you need help on the transfercase end, Jeff and I might be able to help you out.
Breakdown of install:
http://www.weirhotrodproducts.com/id2.html
If you guys are really serious, check this out. It doesn't address the transfer case end, but the engine end is taken care of...
http://www.weirhotrodproducts.com/
If you need help on the transfercase end, Jeff and I might be able to help you out.
Breakdown of install:
http://www.weirhotrodproducts.com/id2.html
'JustDreamin'
Dream: 6LV8 Turbo Bravada
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
Any clue as to how long (short) the bellhousing is? (ie block face to trans mounting face?) I know you're a few miles from home (ok, half the planet) so this is really not a fair question, but just curious as to how much distance the custom bellhousing saves.
'JustDreamin'
Any clue as to how long (short) the bellhousing is? (ie block face to trans mounting face?) I know you're a few miles from home (ok, half the planet) so this is really not a fair question, but just curious as to how much distance the custom bellhousing saves.
'JustDreamin'
George Blake
DONATING MEMBER
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
http://news.thomasnet.com/fullstory/473624/1620
There. Found it. When you call them, tell them your currently running a corvette 700r4 and they may be able to set you up with a unit that has the shifter set back in the correct spot so you can use a GM type filler panel in your center console. If you gonna do it. Do it right.
Also see if they can do a 27 spline output on it. Save you a LOT of trouble.
http://news.thomasnet.com/fullstory/473624/1620
There. Found it. When you call them, tell them your currently running a corvette 700r4 and they may be able to set you up with a unit that has the shifter set back in the correct spot so you can use a GM type filler panel in your center console. If you gonna do it. Do it right.
Also see if they can do a 27 spline output on it. Save you a LOT of trouble.
Syborg Twin Turbo
Syborg Twin Turbo
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
looks like i am going to do this conversion
looks like i am going to do this conversion
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
I'm not real clear on why you guys are wanting to get a new bellhousing. The only thing I can guess is that you are wanting to keep a "semi-stock" shifter location? I'm not real clear on why that is important either? Is there really a stock "shifter location" in a Sy/Ty application?
Especially marty's RWD truck with what I'm sure is going to be a custom console anyway.
Just seems like alot of extra work for little benefit in reference to the bellhousing......The conversion in general is badass.
I want to see an auto tranny hold 2nd gear at 2200rpm and 100%tps...... When autocrossing, I don't want the tranny going between 1st and 2nd...I want second all the time, and at low RPM, you nail the gas, and it shifts to first....Giving unexpected results......I still contend that a 6spd, or even a 5spd would be a helluva lot more fun when setup properly.
I'm not real clear on why you guys are wanting to get a new bellhousing. The only thing I can guess is that you are wanting to keep a "semi-stock" shifter location? I'm not real clear on why that is important either? Is there really a stock "shifter location" in a Sy/Ty application?
Especially marty's RWD truck with what I'm sure is going to be a custom console anyway.
Just seems like alot of extra work for little benefit in reference to the bellhousing......The conversion in general is badass.
I want to see an auto tranny hold 2nd gear at 2200rpm and 100%tps...... When autocrossing, I don't want the tranny going between 1st and 2nd...I want second all the time, and at low RPM, you nail the gas, and it shifts to first....Giving unexpected results......I still contend that a 6spd, or even a 5spd would be a helluva lot more fun when setup properly.
George Blake
DONATING MEMBER
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
Marty, if your doing 2wd, you've got it made. Don't worry about the transfercase end.
Read the info on them. If it was a bolt in, everyone wouldn't be wanting the conversion plates.
Marty, if your doing 2wd, you've got it made. Don't worry about the transfercase end.
Read the info on them. If it was a bolt in, everyone wouldn't be wanting the conversion plates.
midnightbluS10
Banned
Re: Might convert to a 5/6 speed in the gt
There's always the T56 for trucks.
http://www.keislerauto.com/gm/transmissions/truck_6spd.asp
There's always the T56 for trucks.
http://www.keislerauto.com/gm/transmissions/truck_6spd.asp