MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

coupecustom

coupecustom

Member
I’m looking at these two systems as a possible solutions for a stand alone for my Ty. I've got several upgrades and will need a solid tuning method. I’m having the most trouble with cost. The dominator is significantly more, but does have more built in features too.

I understand this community leans towards Holley, I’m just trying to justify it for myself. Is going with Holley really worth it? Here’s my additional system needs:
boost solenoid and control
A/C control
e-Fan control
intercooler pump control
TTC lockup

MS3Pro and Holley can do all of the things listed above. However, I believe that since these are all outputs, the dominator would have to be used and I would have to therefore get the J2B or J3 connector? Or could I get a V8 injector harness for the Holley and have 2 more outputs? The MS3Pro brags that this can be done, hadn’t found out yet for the Holley. As a side note, intercooler pump and e-Fan would probably be programed to run at the same time, so maybe one output.

Now for pros and cons
MS3Pro does not support low z injectors, you have to add a $270 versa fueler. Not really an issue yet, but future mods, could be.
MS3Pro has trans control through another module. Basically a microsquirt. Again, I don’t have an electronic trans, but future mod may be.
MS3Pro works on the mac, I have a mac.
I'll probably have to use my work laptop for the Holley (windows).
TunerStudio does not seem as user friendly as Holley EFI software.
Wiring harness for MS3Pro is certainly not plug and play and therefore I will need to crimp and solder everything myself.
MS3Pro requires external wideband module. I have a PLX, never installed, so not a huge deal to me, but I could sell if I went Holley. I think you have to use a holley WB02.
MS3Pro does have built in alternator control and AC control as well.
Dominator is plug n play and has built in trans control
I’m thinking I’m somewhere around three weeks to install the MS3Pro vs about a week for the Holley.
Holley has several write ups on this forum and good instructional videos plus support from selling vendor. MS3Pro also has support from DIYAutoTune which includes a forum, but nothing specific to the Ty on their forum, or at least very little.

Since right now, I only need about 80lb injectors high z is fine, so I don’t need the add on module. I also have the factory trans so no electronic control is needed at this time. That basically puts my specific cost for the MS3Pro at about $1500 after the ECU, wiring harness, connectors, shipping, ect.
Add in injectors thats $1800 or so.
Add in future electronic trans and low z injector control $2600
Cost for the Holley no trans harness is about $2650 (Hood has the best price anywhere I could find). Add those injectors and we’re at about $2950. Don’t think I factored in a harness for additional inputs/outputs.

Last thing, those using Holley, are many of you actually using more than 4 inputs/outputs? It seems like I could go the HP route and be done for somewhere around 2k. Then sell and upgrade to Dominator in the future if need be for trans control / low z.
 
autoaddictions

autoaddictions

Active member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley

Re: MS3Pro vs Holley

I am no expert on the holly. I have played with the software extensively. I use a BS3 in my Syclone and I'm extremely in touch with that system. I use a MS3 Gold box from EFI source in my Lsx turbo S10. So I can give you my opinion. If you are not comfortable with wiring you truck I'd say go for the BS3. They offer a plug and play harness threw a 3rd party. This makes install a snap. The Bs3 system and the ms3 use practically the same software now from EFI analytics and it's very easy to navigate. The auto tune is a amazing and makes short work of getting a truck up and running in no time. Holly has auto tune as well but it's no ware near as good.

The ms3 will require you hard wire the hole deal as well the Holly. The ms3 will work with any WB o2. The big and holly you need to run there sensor. The ms3 gold box is the better deal over the ms3pro. You won't use the 10 injector drivers over the 8 in the gold box. That's pretty much the difference detween them. Other than the ms3 pro is water resistant!! Great for water craft. The ms3 will do everything a holly will do and more. And way more than a base BS3 system. I also run the micro squirt on my ms3 to control a 4l80e. It's by far the best trans controller I've used. Simple to set up an tune. And at a cost of 449 the cheapest. You can connect it threw a can connection to the ms3 so you only need power and ground can hi and low. The rest of the required info travels threw can. TPS RPM ect. The gold box with build you on harness kit is only 800 dollars. Tuner studio software is 49.00. It's stupid cheap and very powerful.
In summery. The bs3 base no trans controller is the easiest to install. cost around 2200. Harness adapter another 750. Trans upgrade 600 more. Batch fire only. Race pack dash can connection upgrade 400.

The holly dominator. From my research was going to cost 3500 with all the harness and sensors. They price it all separate. Thats with trans control harness. And w band. will dobatch fire or sequential if you go COPlug.
Race pack dash required can adapter from holly. 350.00

Ms3 gold box with connectors and 8 ft harness you need to terminate. 950.00 will do batch or sequential with COP setup.
Micro squirt box with 4l80/4l60 harness 449.00 tuner studio software 49.00. Free upgrades.
Works with Racepack dashes threw can. No cost! I use IQ3s in my s10.

Hope this helps you way you options.

The cost saving of the ms3 is not deniable. Tech support threw holly is the best of the 3. ms3 tech support for hardware you will call on EFI source there good guys and very helpful. Software support threw EFI anylitics. Very good.
Big stuff support is ok but slow. John meany is a genius but he isn't very good with making normal people understand what he saying.
 
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JSM

JSM

Active member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

All options are valid, some offer more things than others and fit different budgets. If you look at the racers where expense is the last priority and performance of the system is key you will see either Holley or BS being used, in the past 2 years the drive has been to Holley.

I have yet to see MS used on a full on race car, I am sure it has been done but it hasn't been seen on any I have been around. Is it a vaild system for some situation very much.

Right now I suggest everyone use the Holley. I have seen no downsides aside from initial cost which only happens once. The use and ability of the system you must deal with every time you turn the key after that.
 
coupecustom

coupecustom

Member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

Thank you for the feedback. You can see why this is not the easiest decision.

I looked up the comparison between the HP and Dominator here:
http://documents.holley.com/techlibrary_hpdomecuuseanddiff.pdf
They're essentially the same, but the fact that the HP does not have a speed input is a cause of concern to me, as one of my next upgrade plans is to do COP. I think I may just be getting myself into a system that I will more quickly want to upgrade than anything else. So to me, that's out.

BigStuff was not a consideration for me till reading autoaddictions post. However, given the capabilities out weighed by both MS3 and Dominator, and the fact that for me personally, I don't need the plug and play aspect, I don't think I'll go with it.

JSM said:
The use and ability of the system you must deal with every time you turn the key after that.
Click to expand...
Is an extremely good point. I wonder how many street cars run Holley vs MS3? Race cars is one thing, but street cars, like my Ty, is another. I'll be driving it regularly and occasionally hitting the track and auto cross. I need something reliable for sure. I question the Holley a bit in the fact that it 'is' all in one. While its convenient it also poses a problem. Something goes bad in it and I'm out for a whole new ecu or fix and repair time. Whereas, the MS3, is less to replace and individual components like the WB can cheaply be replaced. Something to think about.

Screen shot of the home page is really nice and helpful to show that the same/similar software is used on a major production system like BS and MS. Its a bit busy, but perhaps some of that is configuration. I'm a software engineer by trade, so I'm sure I'll figure my way around the software, its just who wants to do work when your not at work ;)

Last night I was leaning towards Holley. After reading and further researching, I'm leaning towards MS3.
autoaddictions said:
The cost saving of the ms3 is not deniable.
Click to expand...
No doubt
 
JSM

JSM

Active member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

I have installed a holley 3 times now, and won't install anything else at this time. It works VERY well and being all in one is not a disadvantage. Actually its better as you know where the problem is if you had one. I suspect unless you wire something wrong, you wont though.
 
wildphil

wildphil

I Love My Ty's
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

I went with the Holley Dominator because of it being all in one unit. Things usually work better if they are made to work together in one unit. Instead of using different units and hoping they work well with each other. I change things on my car all the time. That is the reason that I chose the Dominator over the HP. It was costly but it should be the only one that I will ever need to buy.

I haven't installed it yet. Hopefully it won't be much longer. I have two other SyTy's and have been trying to get everything taken care of with them before starting that project. I have to see when my expert Dominator installer can help me.

Have you watched video on how easy it is to tune with. Watching video on them assured me I had made the right choice. That and with so many other SyTy owners Choosing the Holley. I thought getting help with it would be easier.
 
SYCLONE-2234

SYCLONE-2234

New member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

I love my dominator and digital dash combo...super easy to work with. My sy fired right up, just re configured one of the base calibration settings for my specs, it's been running like a banshee ever since. Spend the extra money, it will be worth it in the long run. Holley A+ !
 
mattw

mattw

Active member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

JSM said:
I have installed a holley 3 times now, and won't install anything else at this time. It works VERY well and being all in one is not a disadvantage. Actually its better as you know where the problem is if you had one. I suspect unless you wire something wrong, you wont though.
Click to expand...


Correct me if I'm wrong but the Holley can't be used with a flex-fuel sensor to automatically adjust for e85 and varying mixtures? To me this is a big disadvantage and it seems weird to me that they haven't added this feature...
 
MotoCam360

MotoCam360

Member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

mattw said:
Correct me if I'm wrong but the Holley can't be used with a flex-fuel sensor to automatically adjust for e85 and varying mixtures? To me this is a big disadvantage and it seems weird to me that they haven't added this feature...
Click to expand...

The MS3Pro definitely does this and does it well...that's what I'm running.
 
F

FastBlackTA

Member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

I have an ls engine on the Holley in a sy and I would not recommend anything else even on the v6 platform - boost control, 4l80 control, meth control ....... You name it the Holley does it. The digital dash is icing on the cake.
 
autoaddictions

autoaddictions

Active member
Re: MS3Pro vs Holley EFI

FastBlackTA said:
I have an ls engine on the Holley in a sy and I would not recommend anything else even on the v6 platform - boost control, 4l80 control, meth control ....... You name it the Holley does it. The digital dash is icing on the cake.
Click to expand...

It's all about experience. I year ago I'd of said the same thing about the BS3 system. Since then I have installed a ms3 and tuned it myself from scratch. It opened my eyes to what else out there. Holly system is wonderful. With all The add ons your holly system is close to 4grand. The ms3 with trans and a racetrack dash is half that. And it does everything a Holly will do.

If cost isnt a factor then the Holly is probably the best choice. However the ms3 will get the job done and you have an extra 2 grand to spend on another area of the build.

My advise would be to download the software for all 3 and play with them. See what seems to make the most sense to you.

Any of the 3 will get it done.
 
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A

adrenalin rush

New member
Some very compelling points here! Great information from Frank and the rest of the SYTY community. I am a fan of the MS3, its easy to use, powerful and cost effective. It's great that the Buick V6 is finally getting a PnP unit from MS3 but when will the SYTY get one? That would be the icing on the cake! I am seen the post about the PnP unit that is coming but the Buick ECU rings in at $1400 bucks, can we get that for the SYTY?
 
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